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More Prison Space Required

 
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Chris
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 9:18 am    Post subject: More Prison Space Required Reply with quote

We're always being told that people are let out of prison early because our prisons are overcrowded. Murderers get let out early, paedophiles get let off prison terms all because our jails our full.

So, it comes as no surprise that the Crown Prosecution Service is going to introduce jail terms for people who use their mobile phone or sat nav whilst driving. Yes, let's let the murderers and rapists walk free, and lock up those that type a postcode in to their sat nav whilst driving.

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30100-1297745,00.html
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Nicepix
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chris, In recent years New Labour have introduced hundreds if not thousands of new laws and tougher legislation. It is all rhetoric!

They can bring out all the laws and penalties they want, but without proper policing no one will ever fall foul of them. All police forces are reducing the number of police officers and increasing the number of PCSOs. These PCSOs have no powers worth mentioning and will not result in any arrests or prisoners. They are there for 'reassurance' purposes to make people feel safe even if the reality is different. This new policy is exactly the same principle. It makes you think that something is being done when in fact nothing is being done.

The facility to prosecute someone for 'Dangerous Driving' has been in existence for donkey's years, well before mobile phones were in use. Try to get someone prosecuted for it is a different matter. Unless it involves a death or near fatality CPS nearly always drop it to the lesser offence of 'Due Care' because it is easier to prove. Nothing will change.
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ChrisNicholls
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I reckon they should build special wings on the prisons for all the fish eaters Wink
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

recently i have questioned my opinion of our present ruling party Neutral
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 11:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The simple answer to prison overcrowding is to put more people in gaol!

I've spent over twenty years as a front line bobby and the only things criminals are frightened of is prison and police dogs. At the moment the chances of getting caught, convicted and imprisoned are negligible and so this situation fuels more crime. The more crime there is, the less chance they have of being imprisoned and so the cycle goes on.

By building a lot of new prison spaces they could implement a stiffer regime whereby sentences reflected the crime rather than the availability of prison paces. This would entail more people being sent to gaol for longer which would in turn create a greater deterrent which would ultimately lead to less crime and therefore less prisoners. At the conclusion of this cycle the government could close down all the old, inefficient gaols and concentrate funding on the newer, more efficient ones.

The second measure I would advocate is to forget about the rehabilitation aspect of prisons. It is very costly and very inefficient. In short it doesn't work. Forget this nonsense and concentrate on the punishment aspect.

Of course there is no chance of this happening because this country's economy relies on there being a high level of crime. Too many jobs in manufacturing, distribution, retail, insurance, etc are dependent on replacing stolen goods. And the black market of cheap knocked-off goods keeps the under classes quiet.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nicepix wrote:

Of course there is no chance of this happening because this country's economy relies on there being a high level of crime. Too many jobs in manufacturing, distribution, retail, insurance, etc are dependent on replacing stolen goods. And the black market of cheap knocked-off goods keeps the under classes quiet.


Our economy relies on a high crime rate?

That's a new one, not heard of that before.

Picture the scene. Top political bod addressing his colleagues.

"we can't build any new prisons, how will the 'under classes' earn a living if we have to lock them up instead of just giving them a slap on the wrist? and think of the unemployment if manufacturers have to make less stuff. I know, lets leave the prison thing for the moment and see if we can host the olympics instead"

or was you being serious Clive? Wink Wink
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 3:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One easy answer! Capital punishment!
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 5:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChrisNicholls wrote:
Nicepix wrote:

Of course there is no chance of this happening because this country's economy relies on there being a high level of crime. Too many jobs in manufacturing, distribution, retail, insurance, etc are dependent on replacing stolen goods. And the black market of cheap knocked-off goods keeps the under classes quiet.


Our economy relies on a high crime rate?

That's a new one, not heard of that before.

Picture the scene. Top political bod addressing his colleagues.

"we can't build any new prisons, how will the 'under classes' earn a living if we have to lock them up instead of just giving them a slap on the wrist? and think of the unemployment if manufacturers have to make less stuff. I know, lets leave the prison thing for the moment and see if we can host the olympics instead"

or was you being serious Clive? Wink Wink


£35 Billion a year and that is just the insurance claims:- http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/171599.stm

Historically only a quarter of burglaries result in an insurance claim: http://www.crimereduction.homeoffice.gov.uk/toolkits/db020208.htm

So, if that figure is taken as representative of all crimes, car thefts, shed breaks, etc, then the ball-park figure of the cost of crime in respect of goods stolen and damaged is £140 Billion (£140,000,000,000) per year. The UK population is around 60 million 60,000,000). Therefore the annual cost of crime in respect of goods stolen and damaged is estimated to cost every one of us well over two grand each. Don't forget that offences such as shoplifting and bilking from petrol stations will not be covered in these figures, but they all add to the economy as we have to share the burden in higher prices.

So, at least £2,300 each per year and that is before you key in the additional costs such as legal fees for criminals, probation services, prisons and police all which generate jobs and keeps the money going round.

Now for the second part; Ask yourself why the Police don't properly police car boot sales and auctions?

The only time a senior police officer made a serious impact on crime figures he got shafted. The government don't want to lose this important part of the economy. The only time that they would consider reducing crime to any great extent would be if the high level of crime negatively affected the country's economy as it did in New York before the well publicised 'Zero Tolerance' regime.
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ChrisNicholls
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 5:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The true cost is likely to be very much higher then.

I know loads of people who have suffered losses and not bothered to report it because "it's not worth it"

The only way to reduce crime is to make the punishment very much harsher.

EDIT.

I would love to see harsher punishments, maybe then the sod who stole the lead off my roof last week would of thought twice. Did I report it? see above Rolling Eyes
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 6:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chris, I had factored in the 75% who don't report it. What is not covered is the 'leakages' suffered by shoplifting and bilking from shops and petrol stations and fraud. Fraud in itself is estimated at several £billion.

I vote that we build more prison ships and send them off to Australia. It seemed to work last time. Very Happy
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 6:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trouble with that one is there is always a chance the buggers will come back Very Happy

Can't we just bring back hanging?
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 6:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChrisNicholls wrote:
Trouble with that one is there is always a chance the buggers will come back Very Happy

Can't we just bring back hanging?


that's capital, is it not. would you be comfortable at the event when perpetrator is hung Question
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 7:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When politicians talk about 'tough new laws' what they are doing is creating an opportunity to make a party political statement on issues on which adequate law already exists. They are failing to deal with the issues so 'tough new laws' are a way of appearing to tackle something. It is smoke and mirrors, and our media keep falling for it because 'tough new laws' makes a good headline.

If you use your mobile phone while driving, in breach of the current laws and knowledge of road safety, you are an idiot. 'Tough new laws' will not change that.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 7:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chobson wrote:

that's capital, is it not. would you be comfortable at the event when perpetrator is hung Question


In the right circumstances yes, very happy in fact.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 7:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

most things appear to have a political advancment agender these days, pisses me off. CN please excuss the spelliing Laughing
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